Is the bible wrong?

or do you just want to take what you think from it and that's it?

Published on March 15, 2005 By Phoenixboi In Blogging

I have to personally thank Champas for finding this for me. I think it is great! In a previous article I was trying to point out how alot of Christians.. (not alot NOT all Christians) seem to want to judge and condemn quickly.

What I find hypocritical is that they can take verses out of the bible when it suits them and disregard other verses as "non applicable" to this day and age. And then they turn around and say that the law is the law and God gave it to us so we have to follow it or we will be doomed to eternal damnation in hell.

So I have to thank again Champas for the following.. it just points out so much of what I am trying to say. You wanna follow the bible to the letter.. then read the following.. or doesnt it apply anymore?

Dr. Laura Schlessinger is a US radio personality who dispenses advice to
people who call in to her radio show. Recently, she said that
homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22, and cannot be condoned
under any circumstance. The following is an open letter to Dr. Laura penned by
a US resident, which was posted on the Internet. It's funny, as well as informative:

Dear Dr. Laura:

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I
have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge
with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual
lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it
to be an abomination. End of debate. I do need some advice from you,
however, regarding some of the other specific laws and how to follow them.

1. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a
pleasing odour for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbours.
They claim the odour is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in
Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for
her?

3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her
period of menstrual cleanliness - Lev.15:19-24. The problem is, how do I
tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offence.

4. Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and Female,
provided they are purchased from neighbouring nations. A friend of mine
claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you
clarify?
Why can't I own Canadians?

5. I have a neighbour who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2
clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill
him myself?

6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an
abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality.
I don't agree. Can you settle this?

7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have
a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my
vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?

8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair
around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27.
How should they die?

9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me
unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two
different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of
two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to
curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of
getting the whole town together to stone them? - Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't
we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with
people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you
can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and
unchanging.

Your devoted fan,
Jim

Comments (Page 2)

Phoenixboi

on Mar 15, 2005

1Cor. 6:9 Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders

Were these the words of Jesus himself?? Where did Jesus say .. and Im talking the words of Jesus .. not of anyone else...where did Jesus himself say that homosexuality is a sin? Not Paul or Peter or Mark or anyone else... Where did it come out of his mouth Jesus himself that homosexuality is a Sin? Until you can show me that he himself said it.. then it doesnt mean anything to me. Because havent you all been saying that "Noone comes to the Father but by me?" he didnt say .. by Paul or Peter Or Mark Or John Paul or anyone else..
see the argument here that I am trying to make?

ANd then you ask me if I think the bible is lying and say Jesus is the only way.. it didnt say Paul or Peter is the way too did it.

dharmagrl

on Mar 15, 2005

but see.....those are all references to the Old Testament.....the "old covenant". When Jesus came, shed his blood, and died, rose again and ascended to heaven, he made the New Testament...the "new covenant".....

Oh here we go again...'the NT cancels out Leviticus' argument.

I'm happy doing what I'm doing, P's happy doing what he's doing, and you Christians are happy doing what you're doing. Where's the problem? (that was a rhetorical question, I know that the BAC's among us will say that P and I are going to hell because we either don't believe in their god or we're doing things that are sinful...my point is simply that if people left each other alone and minded their own spiritual beeswax everyone might be better off)

Phoenixboi

on Mar 15, 2005

Oh here we go again...'the NT cancels out Leviticus' argument.

They want their cake and to eat it as well D.. what they dont see is the bogger picture. The real spiritual truths. They still want to be sheep and hand over their spiritual responsibilities over to someone who told them that they need to do it themselves and showed them how to do it.

my point is simply that if people left each other alone and minded their own spiritual beeswax everyone might be better off)

Exaclty.
Not only better off but there actually might be some peace and harmony on the planet right now, without all the self righteousness.

messybuu

on Mar 15, 2005

The trouble is that people take what is written in the bible too literally.. even at face value. What they need to do is to understand the esoteric and spiritual significance by which the words were said.

So, your figurative interpretation is the one that's right, and everybody else's is wrong, because we don't read into it what we want to read?

No where in this whole debate have I seen people acknowledge that or the other quotes which were given in the original. Do you still sacrifice? Do you work on the sabbath? Do you wear clothes made from two different thereads? Do you eat shellfish? Are you short in stature? Do you wear glasses? People seem to dismiss all of this because they recognise that it isnt relavent to the way that we live now.

That's because he fulfilled the law. We've said that a few times already. And I also quoted from the NT where it says homosexuality is still a sin.

But will we fullfill the prophecy that Jesus made? That "we are also gods and we will do even greater things than he did?"

Where does Jesus say that?

Well, it's in the Bible, and the Bible is supposedly inspired scripture from the Lord, so I don't see why you'd disregard it just because it isn't in red text. Oh, I know why. People don't like thinking of themselves as sinners. Fine, believe that the Bible is inspired scripture and at the same time that it wasn't.

William Volterman

on Mar 15, 2005

Except when jesus came the covenant was fulfilled and thus not everything applies in the old testament anymore

As well render unto caeser what is caesers... still gotta follow the local rules...

messybuu

on Mar 15, 2005

Oh here we go again...'the NT cancels out Leviticus' argument.

If you don't agree, then fine. Just respect our beliefs as we've respected yours. Christians too deserve the right to have their beliefs respected.

I'm happy doing what I'm doing, P's happy doing what he's doing, and you Christians are happy doing what you're doing. Where's the problem? (that was a rhetorical question, I know that the BAC's among us will say that P and I are going to hell because we either don't believe in their god or we're doing things that are sinful...my point is simply that if people left each other alone and minded their own spiritual beeswax everyone might be better off)

He started the thread about how some Christians are cruel to him and tell him he's going to hell because he's a homosexual, and then we say that although homosexuality is a sin, we are all sinful and what not, and then he starts not minding his own business about his beliefs. If he wants Christians to mind their own business, then he should mind his own. If he has a problem with bigots, then he should deal with those bigots.

Phoenixboi

on Mar 15, 2005

Where does Jesus say that?

Book of John Chapter 10 and John 14:12

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

Well, it's in the Bible, and the Bible is supposedly inspired scripture from the Lord

Has the bible been kept word for word exactly as it was first written? Hasnt it been chopped and changed over the centuries in order to fit in with the rule of the day?

People don't like thinking of themselves as sinners. Fine, believe that the Bible is inspired scripture and at the same time that it wasn't.

I think that it is time for people to stop thinking themselves as sinners and thinking themselves as sons of God who are here to fullfill their destinies as children of God. Start to grab onto the positives of your life and everything will be given to you. Keep thinking you are the dirt and that is all you will be worth. Follow your hearts and do what is right for you. Be an example just like Jesus was, dont judge or condemn or throw the stones, because that is how you will be seen.

dharmagrl

on Mar 15, 2005

If you don't agree, then fine. Just respect our beliefs as we've respected yours. Christians too deserve the right to have their beliefs respected.

Where did I say that they didn't? Where did I disrespect anyone's beliefs? Because I made the comment about the NT and Leviticus cancelling each other out? That's not disrespectful. Disrespectful would be my saying that christians are all morons and that the bible is full of shit. I never said that, and I wouldn't say that. My beliefs are a lot closer to christianity than a lot of people realize...

If he wants Christians to mind their own business, then he should mind his own

If the Christians in question had minded their own business, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Phoenixboi

on Mar 15, 2005

If you don't agree, then fine. Just respect our beliefs as we've respected yours. Christians too deserve the right to have their beliefs respected.

Im asking Christians to tell me where Jesus himself said that homosexuality is a sin. Where anywhere has Jesus himself condemned people who are gay?

Still no one can answer this question.

If he wants Christians to mind their own business, then he should mind his own.

Are christians ever gonna mind their own business???

Phoenixboi

on Mar 15, 2005

D..you know you have an ability to bring sense.. As soon as people question the bible or christian beliefs then its hell to pay..they get into a flutter and start not making sense and go on about how we are being disrespectful.

bakerstreet

on Mar 15, 2005

The problem isn't the extent to which people are intepreting the Bible, or who they think are going to burn in hell, or whether they choose to believe things that don't make sense...

...the problem is that people need, DESPERATELY, to stop judging people's beliefs by pig-headed, asinine behavior.

The majority of people in American prisons are minorities, but I don't think anyone here would consider me reasonable if I accused a new Hispanic neighbor of being an ex-con. Even if a stereotype plays out statistically, the non-bigoted thing to do is to grant people a human benefit of the doubt.

So, if you don't mind a suggestion, I suggest that you start calling things by their correct name. If someone is being an asshole, please address him as such, not "Christian" or "Atheist".

Phoenixboi

on Mar 15, 2005

So, if you don't mind a suggestion, I suggest that you start calling things by their correct name. If someone is being an asshole, please address him as such, not "Christian" or "Atheist".

Thanks Baker ..point taken. From now on I will call the assholes just as they are.

Thankyou!

messybuu

on Mar 15, 2005

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

Where in this passage does he mention that we'll be gods?

Has the bible been kept word for word exactly as it was first written? Hasnt it been chopped and changed over the centuries in order to fit in with the rule of the day

http://www.carm.org/questions/lost_books.htm
http://www.gotquestions.org/canon.html

think that it is time for people to stop thinking themselves as sinners and thinking themselves as sons of God who are here to fullfill their destinies as children of God. Start to grab onto the positives of your life and everything will be given to you. Keep thinking you are the dirt and that is all you will be worth. Follow your hearts and do what is right for you. Be an example just like Jesus was, dont judge or condemn or throw the stones, because that is how you will be seen.

What's funny is that people criticize Christians for believing their beliefs are right and other beliefs are wrong, and yet, here you are, believing your beliefs are right and my beliefs are wrong, and yet, I'm the bad guy here.

If the Christians in question had minded their own business, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

So, a Christian started these two threads?
By the way, I know plenty of Buddhist assholes. I know plenty of homosexual assholes. Should I start saying "The homosexuals need to quit with the martyr's complex." or "The Buddhists sure do love preaching zen and everything, but they sure love not practicing it!"

Im asking Christians to tell me where Jesus himself said that homosexuality is a sin. Where anywhere has Jesus himself condemned people who are gay?

Perhaps he did. After all, you're under the belief that the Bible is an unreliable translation and not inspired scripture, eh? Therefore, Jesus might have said something concerning homosexuals (in fact maybe even saying they WILL GO TO HELL even if they accept him as Lord and Savior!) that was lost in translation.

Of course, I'll just accept the translation what I have, and no, I don't see him mention homosexuality as being a sin. Now, if everything but the text in red can be disregarded, then kudos to you!

messybuu

on Mar 15, 2005

In this cases sensible meaning agreeing with your lifestyle and your beliefs, right? Unless you can show where I or somebody else doesn't make sense.
Also, can you guys explain how anybody here has not "minded" their own business? I still don't know how anybody's business wasn't minded, since all anybody here is guilty of is responding to two threads.

Phoenixboi

on Mar 15, 2005

But still the original Article hasnt been responded to?

Do people still do the things mentioned in the article? If not then why not?

can you guys explain how anybody here has not "minded" their own business?

I never said that ..it was said by you remember?

If he wants Christians to mind their own business, then he should mind his own.

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